Wrapping Up the Skirt Issue
Wrapping Up the Skirt Issue
Rumor has it that this blog has been kind of busy with comments lately. Seriously, I know that many of you have posted some pretty passionate comments on the subject of Kyla Ebberts and "traveling attire" in general, and we have been listening. I thank each of you for sharing your thoughts, and I want you to know that we haven't been skirting the issue.
This situation involved a judgment call for sure. These situations are subjective, and not everyone holds the same opinions. We serve more than 96 million Customers a year; and every now and then, we'll have a situation that takes on a life of its own. This was the case here.
We always want to apologize if we offend any of our Customers, and we also support our Employees abilities to make decisions. We are apologizing to Kyla, in typical Southwest style, and I hope you will click here to read about it.
Many, many of you on both sides of this issue have asked about a dress code. We do have a dress code for our Employees who use their travel benefits, but we do not have a dress code for our paying Customers. Our job is not to be the fashion police; our job is to take care of our Customers and ensure they have a safe flight.
We are proud of our past that included hot pants and we are proud of our future, and I want all of you to be part of that future.
Comments
As a SWA family member and frequent flyer at swa, good for you flight crew. I am personally tired of having to turn the other way because I accidentally looked over and saw the woman with the ( new meaning ) cut off shorts and saw her buisness without undies. Or the woman who is on a full family flight out of Orlando to Providence in a tube top, that's right a tube top I could see the lower half of her bare breast maybe even a little ^%^ple, yikes. Or the time I saw a girl wearing a bikini top. Please put a stop to the almost nude maddness. We should ask ourselves is this offensive to my mom? just like we ask ourselves would we want our mom on that flight? NO.
Colleen,
Thank you for acknowledging the situation. I hope for all concerned that your message involving no dress code filters down to your employees. I also am hoping that your employees will remember this issue and unless there is a safety issue, treat their customers customers with the respect and dignity they would like to be treated if they were on the receiving end. I do believe that SWA will be encountering some more questions about employee training and the actions taken against the offending employee. Thank you again for listening and finally addressing the issue.
Part two
More from the Mini Skirt Fare Announcement:
"Southwest Airlines today faces
the bare facts and reveals the naked truth."
"Some have said we've gone from loving hot pants to having hot flashes but
nothing could be farther from the truth, "said Southwest's CEO Gary Kelly.
"The publicity caught us with our pants down, quite frankly. The story has
such great legs
Makes Kelly sound like a dope.
While I think this apology should have come much earlier than it did, I'm glad to see that SWA has apologized for it's error, and publicly admitted to the mistake.
Good job!
Sorry Hun,
Too little, too late.
And to top it off, now you're trying to gain commercially from an appalling, disgusting and discriminatory action by your employee and your airline in general. I have lost all my respect for Southwest and the corporate culture that permitted and then ignored this reprehensible action. A company that treats a paying customer the way you did deserves to have its corporate pants sued off of it. And then Kyla can complain about how YOU are dressed.
Say goodbye to my business on Bradley-Midway.
Sean from Connecticut
Debra,
Am I to interpret "SWA family member" as that you are an employee of SWA? If not, the following does not apply to you and I apologize. If so, did you read the statement by your president about NO DRESS CODE and the customer? If yes, your attitude that you are "tired" of your customers looking the way they do, just shows that you have anti-customer sentiment and are willing to degrade customers just on their looks. I am not trying to "scold" anyone here but I would suggest that you restrict your anti-customer opinions to the break room or the "water cooler" where your fellow employees can share your opinions. "Anti-customer sentiment" or degrading comments about customers on this public blog, is just going to keep this topic alive and SWA will have to field more criticism by the travelling public as to why their employees just don't get it.
Thank you for finally addressing this matter publicly, humorously and appropriately.
While I certainly agree with some of the above comments on appropriateness of clothing for flying, I do not believe the clothes in this particular instance warranted the treatment Ms. Ebberts received. The was no indication that pulling a Britney Spears, so I guess you can chalk it up to experience and hope that all involved learned a lesson.
By the way, the "story has great legs" comment was priceless!
I just want to say way to go!! I am really tired of women dressing like harlots. If that lady wanted to dress that way she should not have been apologized to. She knew exactly how she was dressing when she put her clothes on that morning. There were probably children on that flight who did not need to see all that mess. What kind of message are these women trying to send anyway?!!
As clever as it is, this apology is ambiguous and insulting to your front-line employees. If you mean to say that the front line employee erred, come out and say it. If you're saying that your damage control effort failed, that much is obvious to everyone. If you mean to point out that Kyla's story is PR-motivated and incorrect, step forward with the facts that only Southwest has. If you want to avoid taking any position at all, congratulations!
"These situations are subjective, and not everyone holds the same opinions."
OK, so how about telling us the facts so we can have informed opinions rather than uninformed and prejudiced guesses?
For example: Did another passenger complain? If so, exactly what was that complaint, word for word? Do your employees contend that he clothing was configured differently than the way she appeared in interviews? If so, what were the differences? Is there any substance at all to the rumors of missing or thong underwear? If not, would you please quash them immediately?
If a customer is falsely maligning you in the media, you can afford to make an exception to normal policy about making the customer look bad . This passenger has presented her story in the media, and most people will assume that story is correct and complete unless and until Southwest tells its side. You owe your front line employees that much.
I've said it before, but if Kyla appeared on the aircraft EXACTLY as she appeared in the interviews, I doubt anyone would have asked her to change, and any such request would have been an error, in my opinion. If her appearance was different on the flight, the public needs to hear the specifics so that they can feel confident in the judgment of Southwest's front line employees.
In summary: Depending on the facts, your backhanded apology is either too much or too little. I tend to believe that Southwest employees acted reasonably because in my 700 or more flights as a customer I have never seen anything else. But if you won't step forward with the facts to defend your company or your employees, why should anyone else defend you?
I know Herb is a lawyer, but this evasiveness is ridiculous. Defend your company properly and then have Herb challenge Kyla to a Hula contest for $5000. That's a win-win.
I learned of this "news" breaking story via Fox News. I was astonished that this issue was considered newsworthy, and ignorantly brushed off the issue, simply because women now-a-days typically dress like "halloween" for lack of a better word; I think that I have been desensitized to this type of dress attire. However, I found myself in the pool of society wherein, we just "accept" certain things about our society because of its commonality, and when I found myself pondering about thsi type of "acceptance" I recoiled at my cowardice to stand up for the basic minimal standards of society, and what this society was once, dignified by.
Moreover, I became drawn to this issue and anticipated Southwest's response to all of its critics. While Southwest did excellent media and marketing damage control to diffuse this issue, I believe that Southwest did more to encourage society's acceptance of things without considering, if any, the positive, hard-nosed incentives against the acceptance of women dressing like halloween. My fiancee and I travel frequently, and quite frankly, I am disgusted to see women, from teenage girls to women--old enough to be my mother--dressing like halloween--what has our society come to, where we allow our women and encourage our women to dress so whorishly, like halloween? In short, these women leave nothing to the imagination, and they also, don't promote a positive-standard of dignity and respect for the younger women to follow as an example. What's more is that, these type of women with simple minded attitudes that "No one tells me what do, and I will do what I want to do," are same women who complain when a man calls them a whore or hoe or bitch, or cries when men treat them as second class and are used only, for one-night stands. To paraphrase Dave Chappell, "If a women is dressed inappropriately and you are really not that way, don't get mad at [us men] because you are certainly dressed in a hoe's uniform."
Southwest congrats on taking some kind of stand against what is typically acceptable, I just hope for the sake of your kids, my kids and others that this company will stand behind its employees and implement and maintain, any and all, consequences to prevent (instead of rewarding the halloween dressers) passengers (customers) who think they have a right to reveal all of their assets--which they have the right to--to discourage dressing like halloween in certain public areas; it is a matter of public policy and decency, have some decency and cover up, go home or to the club and "sport" your hoe's uniform at the proper venus.
Ms. Barrett,
Wow! Talk about making a 180-degree course correction! Did CEO Kelly give you a good "talking to" after the comments you made just yesterday*?
Well, for me, Southwest's action is too little, too late. I have already directed my company's travel department to remove your airline from our preferred list of carriers. I hope other companies out there also take similar steps to show you how serious this misstep was.
*see the following news link:
http://www.bizjournals.com/sacramento/stories/2007/09/10/daily50.html
I do believe the evil greed has hit again. Shame on SWA for backing down! It all boils down to the fear of loosing profits. Our society is truly in moral decay!
Has either Colleen (Barrett) or Gary (Kelly) been in contact with Martin Reed (Kyla's lawyer) regarding your apology? Do they feel that the issue is closed yet?
Suggestion: Please address these issues while are lined up in our ABC and prior to the beginning of the boarding process in the future. In my opinion, that's when you are the most professional and can be the most discreet as possible.
After her My Space website was posted on one of the comments, I do not feel she is even entitled to one apology. I was appalled at her web site...pretty trashy and not sure that even her mother would "approve" of her site. She is definately not the all american lady and certainly does not deserve an apology.
I am flying Southwest the end of this month and am looking forward to flying with a professional group of people. Just hope that I dont have to sit next to another Kyla lookalike!
Thank you, Colleen! It is indeed relieving to know that cooler, rational heads prevail in the executive suite.
Mr Kelly's comments come off sounding rather sexist. Why is so hard just to say "Sorry" without all the other junk. In response to the other comments posted, I must miss these flights with the half dressed or undressed passengers, or else I MIND MY OWN BUSINESS!
Going Like Sixty seems to think Gary Kelly "sounds like a dope". I think he sounds like a genius, making lemonade out of lemons and creating a press release that makes fun of itself in short order. Like Colleen says, the announcement was made in typical Southwest style - with flair!
WTBB
What you should be apologizing for, Ms. Barrett, is Brian Lusk puffing up his chest in sanctimonious fashion about the Dan Fleschner article on MSNBC All Day site. Whatever the issue about the skirt being too short, for Lusk to be so bold as to imply "We were right. Even Dan Fleschner agrees", is inexcusable. Let me ask you a question, Ms. Barrett.
What would Herb say?
1. The tenor of the Southwest "apology" is nothing short of ridiculous. It will be seen as sexist, and frankly stupid, by many; that being so, why would SWA shoot themselves in the corporate foot a second time?. Surely any business image consultant (the profession that exploded after the Tylenol episode of many years ago) could have told the brainless CEO of SWA and other executives that a simple, straightforward acknowledgment of regret would have been far preferable. The fact of an apology would satifsy some and disappoint others, but the style of an apology should not, itself, create even more PR issues. How stupid.
2. Without a written dress code for passengers an issue like this was bound to arise. And doubtless there is no such dress code because it would be impossible to craft and also to enforce. In the absence of such a code, then, evaluation of passenger attire is left to the discretion, indeed, the caprice, of any individual SWA employee. It is patently inevitable that such a "policy" would lead to conflict and, ultimately, bad public relations.
3. The previous point is underscored by the fact that on her return flight to San Diego a SWA flight attendant complimented her on her attire, the very same attire that cause SWA flight attendant "Keith" so much heartburn earlier in the day.
4. Bottom line to those at SWA: Grow up. You are in the public transport business. Sitting for hours in a cramped metal tube at high altitude with many strangers makes for an interesting dynamic in any circumstance. Fostering employee independence is fine, but you fail your employees and the traveling public by essentially trying to have it both ways. Prompt and sincere acknowledgment of any mistake ought to be THE highest corporate priority. Someone at SWA (or many someones) has clearly been breathing thin for too long.
Give me a break. All this over some skin. Next thing you know, we'll be back to banning nursing mothers. Aren't there more important things in the world to get upset about, i.e. hunger, war, religious freedom, health issues, etc. We Americans put far too much emphasis on skin and it will keep tainting our children until we get smart. Hats off to SW for making a good thing out of a mistake.
What a joke, you're poor attempt with the 'mini-skirt' fares is plain stupid, a juvenile attempt to cover up the fact that you 'stepped in it'.
Not surprised by some of the comments about how poorly or scantily she was dressed. I'll bet they spent a long time looking at her, long and hard before they got caught looking. Any 'decent' person who is offended by something would turn their head and move on.
I'd ask my wife and daughters to fly wearing micro minis just to test. But I'd rather not waste my money on Southworst. There are other abeit more expensive airlines who do not issue dressing lessons or burkas to their female passengers.
I wish SWA was just as attentive to the matter of oversized people boarding the plane. They should ask them to leave unless they pay for two seats.
Kelly sounds like a dope.
He is trying to capitalize on a MISTAKE made by WN employee. If a pilot lands at a wrong airport, will he offer a special Corrigan's Folly fare?
Flair? Stupid marketing.
PS: apparently Part One of my post didn't make it for some reason (no conspiracy.)
Barrett apologized only after making some flippant and tasteless remarks. It came of as insincere. A CEO should not make jokes when apologizing.
Say your sorry, why you are sorry, and what you will do do make it right.
She did that but only after making fun of the original error.
Colleen pulls a 180, typical chick.
Now where are all the southworst supporters ripping on Kyla? Haha!
I assumed you would wind up naming an airplane after Kyla, but maybe Hooter's Airline has the trademark on that........
Thanks for apologizing. It shouldn't have taken as long as it did, but at least you realized you screwed up. I'm flying in to Vegas on Southwest next Friday. Someone who's dressed like Kyla's welcome to sit next to me.
Very true, some women dress inappropriately.
Does that mean that grocery stores, movie theaters, malls and such have a right to deny access to customers whose outfits are subjectively considered risquÃ
I gotta side with those who are criticizing Colleen for backing down; it now seems that Southwest is violating its policy of Employees coming first, Customers second.
If I were "Keith," I'd be updating my resume. Shame on Colleen and everyone on down for letting this man hang out to dry. There was nothing -- NOTHING -- for SWA to apologize to this skank for.
Leah, be ye forewarned. This may happen to you.
I completely stand behind the SWA employees who asked that woman to cover up! As a frequent flyer and a mother of a frequent "UM", I know from experience that there are more conservatively covered passengers out of that "96 million" and I am disappointed that more of those passengers did not speak up in defense of SWA. There is a time and a place for such attire and on an airplane is not one of them. Thank you SWA for NOT having assigned seating, because if my UM was stuck sitting next to something like that woman, I would drive directly to the corporate office and pitch a HUGE fit! Flying on SWA is a choice. Just as SWA can charge an obese person for covering too much, I hope SWA does put a dress code in effect for those that cover too little. The Dallas based crew that regularly helped my little UM to Kansas City...you are greatly missed.
Last i checked this was America right? People can wear what they want. i am just gonna guess here but I would say that the people that are complaining are the 72% overweight americans. This girl should get free flight for life.
Through it all-Thanks. Please back your employees and support them when necessary. They seem to put out your Company culture easily. We try not to sit next to someone dressed as the picture shows, because we are in such close quarters, it is impossible to keep from rubbing up against each other. I don't want to be saying excuse my all the time and trying to keep my eyes averted. I imagine it is quite an eyeful when she bends to get her stuff or stands up and stretches to retrieve her gear or all the body crush when waiting in the aisle to deplane. Wow.
What is the company policy on breast feeding on a flight? Seems like that can expose as much or more in some cases.
To Southwest Airlines: Kindly stick to flying airplanes safely and efficiently. You are not the morality police. If you are sued over this mess, you brought it on yourselves.
To the ignorant Prudes who are offended by the human body, including their own: If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen. Keep your morals and your long, busybody noses to yourselves --or-- take the bus, drive, or hitchhike.
I have spent a lot of money flying Southwest over the years. I'm starting to think something is wrong with you guys.
I think Southwest has forgot that the coustomer is always right, to embaress a large man by making him buy a second ticket is a shame. He should sue, I am a large
man and I have flown your airline and I will never fly your airline again. And you Ain`t the fashion police. Work on getting your flights on time and not loseing luggage.
Paul, what do you mean? Do you mean there may be a time I face a similar encounter with a customer like Kyla whenever I go to work for SWA?
Listen to all the prudes come out of the woodwork. Children do not become damaged from seeing a woman's thighs or even nudity for that matter. Half of the people that make some of these comments would love to see us dressed in ankle length wool swimsuits to the beach. Prudishness is the disgusting attitude, not showing a little skin. Why? because its deny's the basic worth of the individual no matter if they are young and beautiful or old and wrinkly. Clothes do not make the man or woman, the man or woman does by their actions and values.
I do applaud SWA for making the appologies and particularily from the head of their business, but i am less than impressed with their effort to capitalize fron their mistake. That is a little in bad taste.
I doubt I will fly with you anytime soon, but at least you made the effort.
wow! It took two talk shows and a million blogs to do the right thing. Then, you offer her 1 round free trip. Not to mention the other woman that had the same issue. Oh well, she didn't file a complaint, so who cares right! SWA started their blog trying to demean the girl.Explaining to their readers that the skirt was so low she had issues on the Today Show. Hippocrates! Now, a 360 turn. If your lucky get in on the promotion for ten days for wearing short skirts. Maybe the women that wear to much clothing will be bumped off or asked to shorten their bust line. SWA should give Kelly a job!
By the way, this incident is not, & I repeat not, stopping me from wanting to work for SWA! When I will get on, I don't know-but I will. :)
SW had every right to prevent Kyla Ebbert from flying as dressed. Any fashion criticism aside, I do not want someone wearing a too short skirt with no panties to be walking past me at eye level or squeezing past me to get to the window seat any more than I want some mother changing her babies diaper on the tray table next to mine. It just isn't hygenic-especially in the confined space of an airplane. If SW is planning to allow such behavior, then every row should be stocked with Lysol and alcohol wipes.
I am glad Southwest addressed this issue apologizing to the affected passenger. To tell you the truth, I was disappointed the fashion/conservative police invaded southwest, my favorite airline for many years. Now I know it was a questionable judgment by one of your employees which was quickly corrected and not a company wide policy. Congratulations,
A. Molina
Whatever happened to "we reserve the right to refuse service..." Yeah, like Dave Chappelle said, "if you don't want to be mistaken for a cop, then don't dress like one..." Would she have been offended if someone offered her fifty bucks for her services? Gone on TV to defend herself then? I doubt it! SWA does things differently and those who don't like it have other choices, SWAs biggest fans over the years have got to be their stockholders. Has anyone noticed that they are the only profitable airline? Obviously poor miss Kyla was SO embarassed that she felt the need to make a huge issue out of it....cha CHING! Could you see the dollar signs in her eyes as she spoke??? You bet if I still looked like that I would wear the same outfit...TO THE CLUB! I like to hide behind the whole freedom of speech and this is America thing too...I can say or do (or wear) anything I want but how dare you say anything to me! All rights belong to me, not you!
For once I thought a company would take a stand for moral decency and do the right thing. I found myself becoming a huge fan of Southwest airlines because it seemed you would not back down from the stand you were taking on modesty. I guess we will just continue to see a decline in the morality of our culture and continue to wonder why all the horrible acts of our society take place. "Wake up America", each day is growing worse and worse!
Way to go Southwest!
Some people these days have no class! I can put up with the pajamas and slippers that people wear on the planes,..... but I don't like it.
I can NOT put up with slutty girls that think not wearing underwear on a public plane is sexy.
Southwest is getting alot of flack because they are the Luv Airline and the Flight Attendants used to wear hotpants...go back and look at those outfits. Those are way more conservative that half the teenage girls that got on my flight tonight.
Put it away girls!...
And boys, I don't want to see swear words on the t-shirt you got in Mexico..or the cartoon characers having sex in 30 different positions on your t-shirt!
Please! Get some class!
Do any of you people have children?
I understand that it is Southwest's nature to apologize and move on, but I have to say I am a little disappointed since there was really nothing to apologize for. A young, immature woman made a silly decision, encouraged by a lawyer, I am sure. It appears from what I have seen, this is not the only bad decision she has made. It also appears she will make lots of money getting paid to expose herself. America ... you gotta love it.
Anyway, what your employees did was reasonable and, from all informed accounts, was done is a discrete manner. At worst, it certainly was not as rude and vile as many of the comments you have received on this blog and others in recent days.
Oh well, I am tired of hearing about this. I hope everyone else is.
I am upset that Southwest caved in for Kyla Ebbert. While the outcome will be a mini skit sale I think Kayla and others could dress more appropriate even in hot weather as she claimed on the news.
I have noting against a good looking woman dress a certain way but in certain situations that should not be the case as I will point out below.
Everywhere today you see women dressing skimpy even in places of worship where is the respect for oneÃ
I believed the majority of people wanted SWA to recognize their shortcoming and do what was right, apologize and state their view. As for those who disagree with SWA's "now" position, I think you need to realize you don't always get what you want. Air travel is not a very structured or orderly mode of transportation when it comes to people and if you cannot accept that people have a right to travel in whatever clothing they feel, as long as it does not violate law or create a safety issue, then I am sorry to say that you should not be traveling by air. This is always going to be unless the Government decides otherwise. If that happens then I will be addressing my fellow passengers as Comrade.
I wouldnt ride your airline if it waw a free flight. I'd hate to be asked to cover my ankle because my sock wasn't high enough to cover my ankle. What a bunch of bulls$#t. Most of my friends who USED your airline have already switched to american, so, be as prudish as you want, its your airline. But don't whine if you don't get new flyers.
Shame on you. You caved, or was it just a well planned marketing strategy?
You are purveryors of service. It is your responsibility to set the standards by which you serve or refuse service to the public.
Your apology and subsequent "skimpy" fares scheme contribute to the continuing freefall of incivility. You have lost this customer (I thought I was entitled to fly unmolested....inappropriate attire in a public venue is an assault on my sensibilities.) You have lost the patronage of my friends.
We will not soon forget that you chose attention grabbing headlines over good taste.
I have to roll my eyes in disgust with people like Kayla Ebberts. She only wanted Attention and she knows it. Why else do people like her dress like she did the day she flew. I attract attention by dressing classy and stylish...not trashy and cheap! A person of her intelligence does not deserve any apology - just a lesson in how to be a classy lady! Sorry that Southwest had to go through all of this. I hate to say but the customer is not always right. Thank you Southwest for running a great airline. You are my airline of choice when booking all my future travel.
I don't know about the one other girl, maybe she had a similar experiance, maybe not. I'm waiting for the throngs of people that will now "come forward" with their stories. and stories they will be.
Some idiots are sure to come out of the woodwork and claim they have been permanantly damaged by SWA emploees.........sheesh.
Some free legal advise to all. If someone says you wronged them and with thier lawyer by their side, ask only for an apology...........throw yourself at their feet and beg forgiveness! It will save you millions in the long run.
All I want to do is get from one place to another. I shouldn't have to have somebody's hoo-hah in my face.
Dress like a slut, get treated like a slut.
I applaud Gary Kelly. It was a very smart of him to apologize and at the same time announce a miniskirt-and hot pants sale. He showed that he listened and responded to a customerÃ
I understand all this all happened in july so why is it on Dr Phil and in the news. Frankly after watching the young lady sit down after showing her outfit to all of us in tv land amd seeing her underwear I am just glad she had a pair on. Young wemen seem to have no respect for them selves anymore. When you are traveling on a plane with older people and young children show a little respect . Young people are so into their selves anymore they could care less about other people feeling. South West keep up the good work and stand behind your employees.
While I don't give a flip about the clothing brouhaha, I have yet to find any "skimpy" fares that you are touting due to SKIRTGATE.
If you wanted to impress the public and overcome the negative public perception of your staff's poor judgement shown on this one fateful flight, you would lower fares for a limited time to fares that customers (current and future) would consider skimpy.
I am so happy to be a share holder. I only wish I had bought sooner. Thank you for running a great company and for your seemingly endless sense of humor.
Colleen, Please tell your customers what the rules are and then enforce them - with the goodwill and humor that is unique to Southwest. Even restaurants post "No shoes - No Shirt - No Service" signs.
But, as a long time Southwest customer, I don't want to be confronted (and never have been) by flight crews enforcing their own opinions. That would be contrary to the style that has made Southwest successful, and could infest Southwest flight crews with the dominatrix mentality present on other airlines. (Many of us have experienced the "Go ahead and argue with me, and I'll slap your butt in jail" attitude, but not on Southwest.)
Finally, to passengers who are easily offended, get over it. Your dress code does not apply to others. The only rules that apply are those imposed by the airline. If that doesn't suit you, you can always drive to your destination and your rules will apply!
Well, Southwest, despite alot of noise and fury, you ended up getting it right as you always do. Self-deprecating humor and a commitment to refrain from policing flyers' outfits was exactly what most of your long time customers were looking for. The extremists on both sides of the issue will never be happy, but the rest of us appreciate the way you ended up handling this.
Southwest got its start by advertising and providing stewardesses with miniskirts and go-go boots. They were very short skirts too, you can see the old ads on Youtube. I don't understand what Southwest is trying to accomplish by holding passengers to a higher standard then themselves.
Don't have time to read all pages but in case no one has mentioned it..... maybe a bunch of women need to show up for their next flight wearing burqas. Then again maybe they would not clear TSA security..... worth a try :-)
As I heard not to long ago regarding Sean Penn's activist role "Shut up and act"
Same applies to Southwest "Shut up and fly the planes safely and be price competitive"
Here's what I said September 7...
Shame on you SouthwestÃ
People need to get over nudity period. Nudity and skimpy uncoverings do not equal a lack of morality. Its just someone's body. Just because I uncover my legs in front of you does not mean I want to have intimate relations with you. People that suggest what young people wear today is "slutish" etc. Need to raise themselves out of that horrible prudish attitude. Children do not care about all of this if they are raised correctly, they do not even bat an eye. Its the adults that get bent out of shape. Again bare skin does not equal evil.
Look and enjoy someone's beauty if you want, but get your minds out of the gutter. Yes we do wear things to get attention, all people do to some extent. There is a line between enjoying the beauty in others and "perving" after them. If you do not like what you see avert your eyes, its not that hard. Pick up a magazine and enjoy your own personal space.
I am not suggesting we should allow nudity on airlines (although that might solve a security issue or two) but just making a point about its relationship to "skimpy" dress.
Thank you Southwest! I support you 100%! As a frequent passenger since 1978 and a stock owner since 1996, I applaud you and your employees for being what you have always been - First Class!
PLEASE stand up for yourself!! The young lady was cute, tan, etc. but if a creepy person sat next to her she would sure expect the airline staff to do something about it then. There are places where this casual dress is appropriate, and places where it is not! My 16 year old daughter travels frequently and would not wear such a short skirt and I as her mother would not let her! It is common sense!! Why does your staff not wear the mini skirts now? Because it is inappropriate! The young lady and her parents are being very very self centered! In today's political correctness, the airline staff didn't just single this young lady out without some (I am sure unintended) provocation! I hope you don't fire anyone, and I would appreciate some modified dress code! And for the record, I've not flown your airline, and in general am not a huge supporter of the airlines these days!
Some of these comments are disproportionately angry, and the notion of changing a company's entire travel policy because Southwest exercised subjective discretion is ridiculous. Whoever is making that choice should be fired, themselves! Unless, of course, her attire would be permissible in their own corporate dress code.
Listen, comparing the request for this woman to "cover up" and facism in the grocery store is silly. First of all, when you're in the grocery store, you can move along and avoid staring at the bare naked porn-star wannabe's by moving to another aisle. That is not the case when you're on a plane. You're stuck next the the harlot, and it was right for Southwest to ask her to cover up.
I'm disappointed that SW apologized to her, because it is an afront to the rest of the travelers who were offended by this one selfish tramp.
I wonder whether the company would have asked a Muslim man dressed in Jihad garb to change his look in order for the rest of the passengers to feel at ease on the flight. I doubt it. Too much political PC crap for corporations to bear. Breasts, thighs, women's bodies... not good. Well, what if there's a fat guy on the plane with man breasts? Do we tell him to put on a jacket? What if Ms. X dressed in a burka goes to Vegas when it's 104 degrees out. Ms. Y is dressed in a low cut dress under the same circumstances. Which seems strange to you?
Also, when did the men in this nation leave their balls at home? I can't imagine any man asking a women like her to cover up. There is something wrong with him. After all, we get to pay a lot of money to fly in a cramped seat, get served crappy food, and the like, so I don't mind some T&A on the flight. For those of you who don't like it, don't look at it. Conservatives like me, yes some of us actually like the freedom that women have to dress sexy, have been telling liberals for years that we don't like their rock lyrics and we've been told, change the station, don't listen, etc. Now, for you conservatives and liberals who don't like women dressing sexy, move to the Middle East and see how wonderful the attitudes towards dress are over there. Women who don't like the sexy clothing of these young women are usually prudes who try to impose an inane social agenda on the rest of us or look are built like garage doors.
Mini Skirt Fares! I LUV LUV LUV it! You're a PR genius, Gary!
Can I please please have an interview now?
Nicole, still your dedicated applicant.
I weigh 300 pounds. If I show up dressed like a Hooters waitress, with a micromini, an exposed midriff, no panties, and a big stuffed bra, can I too get a free ride? That seems to be the lesson of this sorry episode.
You should have told her to cover up, quit being a strumpet for attention and stuck to it. By the way, this hooker's claim that she's a 'student' and flying all the way to Phoenix for a doctor's appointment was pretty suspect. She probably had a client to service.
I think Southwest has handled the backlash with grace and aplomb. Since I don't know how short the skirt was, I don't know if whether the blanket was appropriate or not. I do think flight attendants put safety first, but they also attempt to make all the passengers comfortable. For those who have no issues with various states of undress, I think Southwest should perhaps add a "clothing optional" flight. I won't be on it because I can just imagine the possible sights as folks reach up into the overhead bins, and if there's turbulence, LOOK OUT.
And who can fault a corporate executive who appreciates legs, whether on a person or a story. . .? BTW, I have no affiliation with SW and I fly in pretty casual dress so please don't institute any "button down" or "formal attire" flights. The seats are not designed for prom dresses.
I have flown SW for years but I have to admit how this skirt-gate was handled was a bit ... let's just say wrong.
First you try to kick some one off a plane for their attire, when SW has no dress code. Then SW stands behind the mis-guided flight attendants actions. Then SW does a back handed apology and uses the entire incident as a marketing ploy.
Can't wait to see your next marketing gimmick when a fat, drunk or out of control passengers is asked to leave next.
So much for taking the high road by just admitting it was a mistake all the way around. Instead SW felt the need to exploit it. GEEZ.
Please remember you are in a customer service industry. I actually flew SW because it was different from the rest. You tried to be more caring to your customers and had fun in the process.
This incident and the exploitative marketing gimmick just really shows ... you are no different from the rest and that is sad.
I want to applaud Southwest Airlines employees for standing up for decency in the 'short skirt' case and asking this woman to cover up. I am just sorry you offered an apology when one was not needed. I am totally offended by the indecent exposure of man's or woman's private bodily parts to the public, whether its on a plane, the shopping mall or wherever. Some areas of the human anatomy should not be for public display.
Yes, I guess it is their human right to do so, but too bad they don't have enough self-respect for themselves and others to cover up. Yes, consider me a prude and happy to be one. That's my right.
Ms. Donna E.
Regardless of what is determined as obscene or appropriate dress there is the fundamental question of how much can companies infringe on individual freedom of expression and mandate the choices that individuals make. As a business I'm sure that this is a difficult line to walk between individual rights and the perceived "greater good" of your other customers. However, as a customer, the Kayla customer story sends a "big brother" message.
Every "next" generation has been seen as provocative, different or inflammatory and Generation Y is no different. What *is* different about this generation is that they have more disposable income, are less influenced by traditional media (and more by word of mouth), and are looking to work for and endorse authentic leaders and companies that reflect their individualism. Kayla and generation Y is not going away and if you lose them, you are letting go of a customer segment projected to be larger than the baby boomers.
I feel as though this situation has been blown completely out of proportion and that this customer is only bringing it up now (2 months later) to gain financially...
As an 82 year old grandmother, with grandkids ranging from 19 - 1, I am very pleased that the "family oriented" SWA took a stand!
Even during tv interviews with this customer, they had to block areas of inappropriateness. On a plane, a blanket was used for the same purpose. Maybe the tv show will get sued next...
HAPPY SWA FLYING CUSTOMER
Sue
WOW - look at the mixed feelings - I don't think ANYONE is right or wrong. Southwest did what it had to do. What OTHER company would have done the same??? HELLO - Mattel? Wal-mart? Come on people!!! OH - and what company could turn a negative into a positive better than Southwest??? WOW! As for you frequent flyers - do you even KNOW the history of Southwest? This has happened once before with a well-known slogan the airline took from a smaller company. It ended up pretty much the same way - making light of an interesting situation! APPLAUSE and STANDING OVATION Southwest! I went online after hearing of this just to buy a ticket for SUPPORT! I feel comfortable to fly with you - you ALWAYS do the RIGHT THING!!! Just check out the stats for Customer Complaints at www.dot.gov - it's all there - PROOF!
I've been reading the comments on this, and not all ,but the majority of the people for this sleazy - dressed girl,not surprisingly are men. Maybe if you men didn't encourage this kind of dressing by all your "staring", they wouldn't do it as much. I don't fly, but I wouldn't want to have to be stuck with a slutty girl, and YES, even in the stores or restaurant it IS inappropiate dress. Decent people don't go to those places to see those trashy women. They go because they need to feed their families. Those harlots make us lose our appetites.Why should we be forced to stand in line at a store with our children,being exposed to that? And as for breastfeeding: I breast fed four children, and never once had to "expose" myself to an audience. Yes, it is natural-but so isn't going to the bathroom, and would you want to do that in front of everyone,just because it's natural? These poor excuses for women are only using their children to show off! They are the sleazy type!
Dear Southwest,
Unless there is an emergency, I am done with Southwest. After many years of using AND talking up your airline, I am done with both. If you were smart, you would have addressed this issue immediately, with much more than just cute slogans. All the hard work that Mr. K. did to build an example of
"a great buisness" was just thrown away. I am now putting you guys in the same catagory as the guys that charge $30,000 for cars that don't even have
descent cup holders. Why don't you change your name to "Puritan Airlines"
"Some have said we've gone from wearing our famous hot pants to having hot flashes at Southwest, but nothing could be further from the truth. As we both know, this story has great legs, but the true issue here is that you are a valued Customer, and you did not get an adequate apology."
It's amazing to me that Southwest considers making sexist comments "apologies." Is this truly what "typical Southwest style" is? If so, your CEO frightens me more than your onboard "Morals Police." Kyla and the other woman who was ridiculed are owed apologies, but IMHO, this one hardly passes muster.
I applaud South Western for trying to maintain a family friendly atmosphere. I see that have apologized, but why? Many of us are tired of always being on the defensive to protect our children from provocative dress and behavior. Thanks South Western. Please don't stop or they'll soon be getting on there nude!
I read the letter of apology, and whoever is the CEO of SouthWest is apparently not a very intelligent individual who does not know how to lead with responsibility. The letter of apology was so half-hearted. Besides, even if it was triggered by a customer complaint, the flight attendants should have told simply turn the other way, it does not require a harvard MBA to figure that out. i hope South West gets sued, and you know that Kyla Ebbert is going to win. (Below is a text of the apology)
The text of the apology Southwest Airlines sent to passenger Kyla Ebbert to be read on a Friday taping of the Dr. Phil Show:
"From a company that really loves public relations, touchÃ
Please don't say you are sorry to anyone. It is about time someone, or a company say enough to the half dress dimwits in this country who walk around half naked for the world to see because they think they are all that. I for one am tired that my children are exposed to an eyefull of their private parts. If I ever get the urge to look at naked people I will go see them at their job I'm sure they will be at the nearest lounge or hooters.
Good for Southwest Airlines and too bad this so-called "lady" was embarrassed! She should have been for her inappropiate outfit. It seems that there is a contest going on who can dress in the lowest cut tops and shortest skirts. What is the point these girls are trying to make? I only can guess!!!! It's refreshing that this airlines took a stand. Enough is enough!
I feel sorry for the passenger who has a mother who doesn't know how to direct her daughter to proper attire. Parents like her mom should be ashamed of themselves. They need to learn to grow up as well.
With your apology at Southwest, should NBC apologize for having to cloud up the screen so we couldn't tell if the all but undress woman was wearing underwear?
No apology was necessary. I am glad you seek not to offend, but come on if I had to sit next to her, you would be hearing from me big time. Would I bet the same appology? If I wanted to see what a hooter's girl wears or doesn't where, I know where to go. I chose not to. IF I EVER GET ON YOUR AIRLINE AND SEE SOMEONE DRESSED IN SLUTTY CLOTHES LIKE SHE HAD ON, YOU BETTER BE MOVING ME TO FIRST CLASS ON YOUR AIRLINE OR ANOTHER! I hope the seats are disinfected as well.
The whole situation could have been a great P.R. piece for you as an airline...you blew it!
I am humored at you lack of a spine for a CEO! I would ask that you step down for inability to stand for a moral issue. Your credibility is is gone!
Dear Colleen C. Barrett,
I have been a Southwest Airlines customer / passenger since the 1980Ã
I just can't help thinking there is more to this story. Things just don't add up at all!!
You guys are freaking nuts. all this crap from an airline that had there girls wear hot pants and whose slogan was "we really shake our tail for you"
There was NOTHING wrong with what THIS girl was wearing on that flight. GET A LIFE! SWA screwed on this deal and they screwed up bad. Unless your trying to look up her skirt , and even thing you arent going to see a thing.
There have been a hell of lot worse attire on SWA flights that needed some attention this wasn't one of them.
You should be ashamed of yourselves for not respecting the decisions of your employees. You hired them to represent your company and to ensure a good name for Southwest. Then, when they stand on moral grounds, you belittle them and their decision by making a joke and an ill-advised attempt at PR.
I agree with Mike and hope sincerely that you will bend over for your customers who prefer modesty as much as you have for your half dressed patron.
To the flight attendant who stood up and promoted modesty: Thank you for doing a good job. Maybe you and Colleen Barrett should change places. It seems you have some good common sense.
One last thing Ms. Barrett...you lost another customer.
To Colleen and Gary --
Congratulations! You both have demonstrated the kind of leadership skills that differentiate bosses from great leaders. You have listened to the collective voices of your Customers and determined that, in hindsight, an Employee's decision might not have been the very best one possible.
In your typical style, you've used class and humor to issue an apology with a level of seriousness as befits the original situation. Your response has been measured and appropriate given the circumstances, and I have to assume that in similar Southwest style, your Employee will not be drawn and quartered for exercising the discretionary authority delegated to him, but simply advised that in the future, a different approach might be less likely to inflame the passions of those who wish to make a mountain out of a molehill.
For those of you who are now jumping on Southwest's case for reversing their original stance, stop and consider one thing. Which approach displays more maturity and "business sense": deciding that, no matter what, you will stick with your original position, OR pausing long enough amidst the finger-pointing and ridiculous rhetoric flying around to admit that things might have been handled better and "owning" the error? I sure liked the old days in basketball when the player who had a foul called on him took it like a grown-up and held his hand in the air to acknowledge that he was wrong. Now, most of the prima donnas display enough acting skills at looking innocent or 'framed' to earn themselves an Academy Award.
I'm proud of Colleen and Gary for holding up their hands and facing the heat.
Kim
External Blog Boy, who appreciates the courage of his friends at SWA :)
Herb ... please don't cave to this bimbo. Our culture has coarsened enough ... no, too much!
Now this is more like it! Southwest should have taken this approach as soon as the incident became National News! Glad to see SWA still has a sence of humor and the ability to appologize when necessary!
I just wanted to comment (and this relates to the Ebberts issue) in that when I fly Southwest, I feel more often than not, that the employees are treating passengers like children instead of customer service delivered with a sense of warmth, friendliness, individual pride, and company spirit. I experienced that wonderful culture people wrote about years ago, but as of late have seen more of a maternal culture. I see passengers being "told" what to do, instead of being asked. It seems that employees are giving the impression that the customer is privileged to be flying. Company pride is wonderful, but what happened to the customer treatment?
As a business aviation graduate, I have always admired your culture. Maybe my sites were set too high from reading books like "Nuts!" I still admire those that have managed to carry on the old culture and your safety record is impeccable, but through my experiences, I don't fly for the customer service. If I fly, it is for the schedule, price, and safety record.
I still hold you in high regard for your dedication to your employees and safety, and I admire you for your apology. It's hard to hold onto such a great culture through the times, politics, and real world situations . . . here's hoping the next time I need to fly SWA I encounter that wonderful culture I read about.
Lets be real about the Kyla Ebbert Story!
Simply Southwest Airlines is the best around! Nine times out of Ten when I walk up to there ticket counter I am greated by a friendly face. I just love how they are always having a good time being themselfs! As a business owner I always stick by what my employees do. Think about it folks, when you have a family and you want to go on vacation, what is the first thing you look for when purchasing a ticket? A cheap Ticket! So when flying with a airline like Southwest which is a low cost carrier, you our going to have a good amount of young children.I also look at the other side of the story, who our you to tell me what I can or can't wear! As a 23 year old male, I am quickly aroused by someone that dresses like Kyla and supports it. AMERICA, who is really in the right!! All I really want is good Customer Service, and like I said in my first sentence that is what Southwest does. When the day comes when I walk up to there Customer Service desk and not see One out of Ten of there Agents smile (like most of the other carriers) thats when I will look for a airline that will give me that. Colleen, you Rock!!
Anothony
It's seems it's all been said already and much better than I could; but I want to say I LOVE THE SPIN put on the skirt issue. It is clever, funny and makes the statement, without being obnoxious about just how out of control, silly and nasty situations can become. In the entire scheme of things, the world issues, it is petty - but again, love the spin SWA used to address and not ignore the event.
Am a customer who flies SWA whenever possible; as do my friends and family. Have experienced service above and beyond several times; once lost a cell phone, SWA traced it, found it and returned it on return flight; once had to change return flight, no problem and always pleasant; the list goes on and on.
Keep up the GOOD WORK
Maryann
Lovely Kyla (have you seen the bags under her eyes and those strangely hardened features? She looks a lot older than 23) now says the airline is exploiting her for its 'skimpy' fares. This bimbo loudly sought out attention in the media, parading herself around on talk shows and now is upset that she got it.
The whole issue of her 'victimhood' needs to be looked at a little closer. I understand she had the top hiked up to her boobs and was exposing her whole midsection to the world. If a 300-pounder like me had done that, you know what the reaction would be, so right there she's calling for special bimbo's rights to expose her belly in the quest for either attention or business. And what would the reaction be if a 300-pound man with a hairy belly did it? Why the double standards?
Second, if you visit her myspace page, she's a self-declared 'swinger' and fan of Britney Spears which is probably informing her irrational toddler-like tantrums. Like Spears, she is demanding attention and screaming when she gets it. She also calls herself 'easy' on her myspace page, and has offered to send photos (clothed? unclothed?) to anyone who finds a fake site on herself (Don't try to change it, Kyla, it's cached). From reading her site, one can conclude that at the very best, this self-described 'swinger' seems to be in the market for a rich man to marry, and in the meantime, seems to be advertising herself to anyone interested in sampling her. Meanwhile, she has told the media she flies 100 times a year, which is awfully strange for a 'student.'
Let's get that straight again - a Hooters waitress cum 'student' - where is she enrolled that lets her fly in out of class 100 times of year, let alone the Hooters establishment, which for all its T&A, is nevertheless a business that requires regular employees. She flashes her belly on flights, and advertises herself for anyone who wants to read it on the Internet that she is both 'easy' and a 'swinger.' Her own words.
What she seems to be really upset about is that her indecent exposure has been hampered by customer complaints and that's probably bad for her business. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to wonder if 100 flights a year flashing one's belly on each flight is a way of trawling for business from lecherly businessmen on the road.
With her threatening a lawsuit and her greed for a cash settlement whetted, Southwest should investigate what this self-described 'swinger' was really doing on all those flights. She probably used her special way of 'dressing' as ads for an unlicensed and illegal business.
When I first heard this news story, I was impressed that a company like Southwest was taking a stand in defense of moral values and decency. I was disappointed with your apology, Southwest- that you didnÃ
Thank you Southwest for your apology, late as it may be. I think that the flight crew overstepped their boundaries when they chastised Kyla for her attire. I do feel that some people (mainly women) need to cover more up but Kyla's outfit as I saw on the Ellen show was not that bad.
Dear Southwest:
In regards to your apology and then "skimpy sale": I, a long time customer, now will probably do everything in my power never to fly your airline again. I will also instruct all who I know to do the same. That was one of the most morally reprehensible turns I have seen a company make. You have thrown off moral decency in a futile attempt to preserve pseudo-customer relations. Children fly your airline, and you now have to answer to millions of parents nationwide. You have lost my support.
I think it is funny that most comment sections on the web have the most recently published comments on top. Here, it is the reverse AND the first comment "happens to be" one supporting the decision. Funny.
Are your guys (no sic) in advertising there clueless? Rather than letting this thing drop, you did it again with this ad campaign. Geez. You deserve all the crap you get. If you really want to make a statement, create a dress code for the airline, publish it and then enforce it.
Also, someone needs to reign in the CEO you said this:
"Some have said we've gone from loving hot pants to having hot flashes but nothing could be farther from the truth," said Southwest's CEO Gary Kelly. "The publicity caught us with our pants down, quite frankly. The story has such great legs, but we have an even better sense of humor, so we're going to jump out there and lower our fares to match the mini skirts we've all been hearing so much about." www.bizjournals.com
Dumb, so dumb! Not to mention to-the-core sexist.
Whatever happened to our ability to say "NO," I don't find that acceptable? Frankly, I'm tired of having half dressed women (and men) shoved down my throat, and that of my 10-year-old son, no matter where I go. Wake up women! It's time to stop being so shallow that you think you have to be half dressed to get some man's attention. If that's the only way that he's interested in you, then you need to realize that he's not looking at you as a person, but as a plaything. Southwest was 100% correct to stand up and decide what dress is appropriate on their airline, just as the rest of us should be able to stand up and say what is appropriate in our restaurant, our office, our place of business and even in our schools. "Individual" rights have gotten out of control, where we're all forced to deal with uncomfortable situations so that someone's individual rights aren't violated. What about my rights to not have to sit next to some woman who doesn't have enough class to know how to dress. Believe me, it's tough raising a 10-year-old today and trying to teach him right from wrong when he has to see women displaying such poor taste on the bus, on the plane, in the shopping center, etc. Women -- put your clothes on and try attracting men with that brain of yours. Rock hard bodies don't last forever, and if you think that will get you through in life, it's time to wake up. And men, stop treating women as if they are nothing more than eye candy. Try showing some respect for women -- who are mothers, daughters, sisters, cousins, aunts, and friends.
To those who are saying they'll never fly SWA again & they'll tell others not to-I think that's rather ridiculous. Don't let this incident stop you from flying SWA. I honestly feel it's the best airline! Let's focus on the many good things the Company does for their Customers & the community. I LUV SWA! :)
"I have Southwest spirit, yes I do! I have Southwest spirit, how about you?"
Super service
On time
Unique
Terrific employees
Helpful
Wants, & willing to, provide Positively Outrageous Service (POS)
Energetic employees
Super fun airline
The best airline ever! :)
Cheers to the person who wrote about Kyla's my space web page. Kayla looks like she is TOO busy to be a student and is busy being a swinger per her myspace. And someone like her deserves an apology.....NO WAY!
I am sorry that Southwest felt they owed her an apology.....Maybe they should have checked her My space page before and saw what they were dealing with.
Kim:
No, Colleen and company should have STOOD UP for their employee who did nothing wrong, rather than putting their fingers in the wind and deciding to reverse course based on public opinion.
What is popular is not always right. What is right is not always popular.
I'll still fly Southwest, but I'm bitterly disappointed by Collen's LACK of leadership here.
colleen, i feel the flight attendant who did this should be fired, i saw the outfit on today and athis girl was dressed fine. i have seen worst. as a retired airline employee. travel quite a bit. years ago we had a dress coat, like suit,tie.
my airline no longer around. so i purchase real tickets. i also seen web sights and another flt attendant did same thing. also you pick on fat people. what;s with your airline. once again you should fire those employees for giving you all this bad pr. some of ur females flt atten dress in short skirts and tight shorts.
I have always found once I sit down in my seat it is real hard to see any of the other passengers, let alone what they are wearing.
If you all think what this girl was wearing is bad, you obviously don't get out much, trust me there is way worse out there.
Is "Keith" a professionally-trained member of the "Fashion Police?" What are his credentials to make subjective decisions about a customer's clothing? Is he imposing his own values (and dress code) on SWA customers? Is he still "at it" or has he (hopefully) learned from this experience? What training and/or policy revisions has SWA undertaken to make sure its employees don't repeat this major customer relations blunder? If I were an SWA investor, I'd be "after the hide" of an employee and his supervisors (including Colleen Barrett) for endangering my investment.
My wife and/or I fly SWA regularly (usually, at least once a month, round trip). We choose SWA because of the low prices, frequent flights to our destinations and (usually) friendly and helpful employees (that's feedback for your marketing department.)
This incident will not stop us from flying SWA because of the above reasons. I expect that most SWA employees would not have taken the same actions that "Keith" did. However, the incident has diminshed our respect for the airline.
Its sad what some people will do for attention and even sadder what some people believe. If you would have seen excatly how that outfit was worn your thoughts would have been different because it was adjusted different. She just wanted to get attention and get her name known so she would have a shot a playboy or other magazines like that. She just happened to pick on SWA to get a low price. And to compare being afraid to fly because of you might be wearing the wrong color or socks, come on what are you thinking that is a dumb compairson and you know it. Did anyone even she her ranchy myspace? That tells it all. She should be saying sorry to SWA for using them to try to boost her x-rated career and SHAME,SHAME,SHAME on the rest of you for helping her suceed that is being just a bad as she is, like feeding fuel to the fire.
In my opinion you should have let her board the plane, but warned her that her outfit was inappriate. I do not like the idea of her hitting the talk show circuit and playing victim. Lots of people get screwed in many different situations. Why didn't she write to a SWA official instead of showing a "who is me" attitude?
I was disappointed to see Southwest didn't stick to their guns on the inappropriate clothing issue. I for one have flown on one flight where
a women was so scantily dressed it was embarassing. I mentioned then
that Southwest should institute a dress code because some people
don't have any sense. I really am tired of seeing peoples underwear.
Maybe you should turn the air down so people will have to cover up : )
Congrats to the SWA employee for exercising discernment in the best interest of all the customers. The line of decency and propriety for public appearance continually needs to be enforced, and we can't rely on the government or courts to do it.
I was on an SWA flight once with a then-famous female actor of Bay Watch. The whole plane erupted in laughter when she came out of the restroom just before landing, having stripped down to a bikini...I guess to make a grand appearance at her destination.
If a woman wants to expose her body in public, then she needs to be prepared for public reaction, which in a sensible society, is to encourage her not to do so.
What is right is not always popular.
What is popular is not always right.
I'm disappointed that you bent to the pressure.
Take a stand, doggone it, for what is appropriate!
I'm glad I had boys!
Bu-Bye:
Tina
Ferguson v. Gies:
"The man who goes either by himself or with his family to a public place must expect to meet and mingle with all classes of people. He cannot ask, to suit his caprice or prejudice or social views, that this or that man shall be excluded because he does not wish to associate with them. He may draw his social line as closely as he chooses at his home, or in other private places, but he cannot in a public place carry the privacy of his home with him, or ask that people not as good or great as he is shall step aside when he appears."
Unruh Civil Rights Act (California):
"All persons within the jurisdiction of this state are free and equal, and no matter what their sex, race, color, religion, ancestry, or national origin are entitled to the full and equal accommodations, advantages, facilities, privileges, or services in all business establishments of every kind whatsoever.
This section shall not be construed to confer any right or privilege on a person which is conditioned or limited by law or which is applicable alike to persons of every sex, color, race, religion, ancestry, or national origin."
In re Theodore William Cox on Habeas Corpus. California Reporter, 90, 1970, p. 24.:
"Neither municipality nor shopping center may exclude individuals who wear long hair or unconventional dress ... merely because of such characteristics."
Keep going Corporate America and you will find yourself in Court losing the case.
As for the people that post against Kyla and her outfit, I really hate your...perfume, hairspray, bad breath...whatever. Now, can I ask the airline to change that? I think not. Why do you, in all of your prudness, get to have an "offensive" outfit kicked off the flight and I have to smell your bad breath or hear you snore for the next 2 hours?
Mind your own business. I have to, to put up with your faults. Right?
As a loyal and passionate Southwest customer I was very dismayed by the Kyla Ebbert mini-skirt embarrassment.
I was even more dismayed at Coleen Barrett's defense of the employee. If an employee made a mistake, than management should acknowledge the fact and apologize for the company's (employee's) misconduct.
If Ms. Ebbert was not arrested for indecent exposure by the police than a Southwest employee should not have inserted his/her own dress code in place of the company's employee operating procedures.
An issue like this mocks the very heart of Southwest's "fun" image and it may take a long time for the harm done to be repaired.
I give CEO Gary Kelly a lot of credit for coming forward and apologizing in the manor he did for the mistakes that were made by the employee and Ms. Barrett.
Having re-read this "apology" several times, I'm not sure that my previous opinion of, "It took a long time, but thanks for finally apologizing" stands.
It's written in a flippant manner, and tries to turn the whole incident into a marketing campaign. While I can, to a certain extent, appreciate the "creativity" that was involved in that (I work in marketing), I think it's in poor taste to try to be funny in your apology, and to turn it into a promotional tool.
I've flown with SWA in the past, and enjoyed the experience, but I doubt that I'll fly with you again after this.
Clear are the differing opinions we've had on what's right and what's wrong and why. My feeling has been that the Southwest employee acted inappropriately. The passenger was wearing something both socially acceptable and common, especially given her age. I can't assume she boarded the plane with any knowledge she was offensive to anyone. Having read through the various comments, I do find that, though my opinion is unchanged, I do respect the differing views, especially of moms (and dads) just trying to raise their kids the best they could. My feeling has become more focused with respect to the passenger being publicly (on the plane and with the knowledge of others) embarrassed than on whether her attire was acceptable or not. As a result, I believe Southwest did the right thing in apologizing. None of us should have to be humiliated because someone else doesn't like something about us. Chances are that there is someone "out there" that doesn't like something about each of us. Chances are, somewhere and at some time, very possibly oblivious to us, we've offended someone. I wouldn't feel bad if a person, for themselves or on behalf of someone else, let me know I've offended someone, even if I had no intention of doing such. What would bother me is if that person acted in a way to embarrass me. I wouldn't want that to happen to me and I don't like seeing it happen to someone else. One writer wrote that men should better respect women - they are our daughters, wives, sisters and mothers (have to read to get proper context and not an exact quote but I get the message). I agree completely. Yet we view the outcome differently. Not only do I have the opinion I do relatve to what happened, but I also have that view out of respect for my similarly aged daughters and how someone might interact with them (no, my daughters do not wear short skirts). The young woman should not have been humiliated and, even if done unintentionally, I feel Southwest acted correctly in making the apology. I'm sure you will teach your children to respect others and not try to embarrass or degrade, especially in the presence of others. Out of respect for those with differing opinions than mine, I would not object to a dress code that resulted in more conservative attire (though this may be very difficult). It's not an issue with me but I would certainly be in favor if it made others more comfortable/less offended without causing a significant infringement on the first group. Then, an individual would know what's acceptable in that setting and could be , if necessary, addressed discretely and courteously, not to mention with more objective basis, befoe he or she is in her or his seat and, like everyone else, just waiting for the plane to take off.
Joe
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That's... a pretty lame apology. Not only did you not say that your employee was in the wrong and did not say what, if any, actions were going to be taken, but you classlessly used it as a marketing gimmick. Poor form, bad taste, and possibly more embarrassing to the girls who your employees harassed to top it off. Great job, there, guys. Humor not appreciated.
You do not have a dress code and allowing any employee to enforce someone else's idea of what is appropriate is disgusting. I don't dress in skirts at all, but if I did - who gets to say if my thigh to knee length is appropriate or if I should be forced to wear it at mid calf or *gasp* if showing those scandalous ankles would just distress the person next to me too badly.
Apologize with a little splash of sincerity, please. And fire the next employee who decides to partake in a little "slut-shaming" publicly with your fabulous marketing strategies.
I like flying with you. I won't until you take a solid stand on this.
At first when I heard the story, I thought the ops agent overreacted. But now learning all the facts, I believe SWA should have backed their employees instead of backing down.
She was on the today show showing off her outfit and how it wasn't showing any skin, yet when she went to sit back down, it showed everything. They even had to blur it. Secondly, from the ops agent, she wasn't wearing that sweater either. Here's another example of someone trying to exploit others for their own profit.
People ask "how can SWA treat their customers that way?" First off, SWA doesn't need customers like that. Secondly, by doing nothing, they would have let down other customers on the flight, especially young children.
SWA might be the Walmart of the airline industry, but that doesn't mean it always has to put up with trailer park trash, someone has to draw the line somewhere.
To really see what kind of person she is, check out her myspace website before it was replaced by a more conservative one after the incident.
Ah, apologizing in typical Southwest style. Does that mean snarky and flippant? Because that's what this press release was. The original situation of some lone, apparently easily scandalized flight attendant passing fashion and moral judgments on a young woman was, in my opinion, offensive. But to respond with a joke is even more offensive to me. I can write off one person's actions, but this press release, as the voice of the company, proves a party line and a corporate environment I want nothing to do with (especially since they, apparently, want nothing to do with me). I even called the PR office number listed at on the press release and was treated dismissively and patronizingly.
I am a longtime Southwest flier who will never fly Southwest again. I was considering it after the initial incident but this press release sealed the deal. Shameful.
Yes, this faux apology clinched it for me. I will not be flying Southwest in future either for business or pleasure.
A genuine apology would have made a difference. But this apology mocks the victim and exploits her degradation to push Southwest's lower fares. As a customer and businesswoman who cares about the bottom line, it is nonetheless not worth it to me to sell out women's right to basic respect just to save a few bucks on air fare.
There are some comments on here that applaud the Southwest employees desire to promote modesty. But there was no modesty rule or dress code on Southwest airlines, and it was inappropriate for the employee to decide that his personal subjective judgment as to another adult's attire was the appropriate standard. The victim's Myspace page is also completely irrelevant; even if the employee had known about her myspace page (which I am sure he didn't), it would not change the fact that she has a right to be respected by customer service professionals.
Greetings,
After viewing an upcoming episode of The Dr. Phil Show, I believe the character of the young lady reveals more than her clothing, and that is revealing indeed. If anyone noticed her appearance on the Today Show with Matt Lauer, he seemed to be favoring her side of the issue as she was wearing the exact clothing she was wearing on the flight in question. Did anyone notice that the Today Show deliberately edited her skir in such a was so as to "wash out" an area of her skirt as she was standing so her panties (?) were not broadcast on camera. If it was inappropriate for television as arguably permissive as television broadcasting is these days, is it not also fair to suggest the Southwest employees were correct in censoring the live image of the same to its other passengers. While I understand Southwest's response and apology due to the realities of customer relations, perhaps taking a stand would be admired if the extra effort for standing up for conscientious policies and principles means individuals displaying bad behavior aren't reinforced for it. Nonetheless, Southwest hasn't lost a customer, but I would have supported the company whole heartedly had they stood by their employee and company policy in this case.
I will no longer be flying on Southwest Airlines. In the past, I have enjoyed good service and low fares. After this event though, I refuse to give SWA any more of my money. Although they claim to have no dress code, they harassed a paying customer and tried to stop her from flying. This is not the only woman who has been harassed by a SWA employee, and I'm sure it won't be the last. SWA's "apology" is disgusting, filled with sexist remarks. It is very clear from SWA's statement that they do not care at all about the complaints. They do not care at all that they made a mistake.
As for the people making judgments about this young woman-stop. In America, we have the freedom to decide what we want to wear. Are you really suggesting that we start having laws on what is considered appropriate attire-for adults? I don't care if this woman dressed skimpily, I don't care if she is "trashy" or what, I care that she was treated horribly and was discriminated against. That is not acceptable.
Southwest, you are truly pathetic.
-one more ex-Southwest passenger
Nice "apology." Regardless of who was right or wrong in the first place, this apology is one of the most offensive things I've ever seen anyone in corporate America put forward. Southwest is off my list, and if I have my way, no one in my organization will fly Southwest again, either, regardless of fare.
I checked out her myspace page. It's easy to find if you just search on her name. She isn't even that good looking in some of those photos. She created her myspace this month. It seems like she is just looking for publicity, and the news media gave it to her.
Do I think the Southwest employee acted inappropriately? Well, yes, I do. I personally don't care what people wear. I worked as a hotel receptionist for almost three years. The only thing I cared about was whether or not our customers could pay their bills.
Kyla has went way beyond her 15 minutes of fame. This seems like a cheap way to get some attention. Perhaps, she is trying to get into _Playboy_ or something?
Kyla denied Colleens (jealous of Kyla) and Gary (i'm a perv) apology! Now, I am tired of Kyla's media attention at this point. But it's nice to know that she refused Collens (wish she could wear skirts without varicose veins showing), and Garys (wish i wasn't married) bribe. Make fun of Kyla all you want, but Collen and Gary showed that they are the real "sluts".
Does Southwest not understand the meaning of an apology? This is offensive in so many ways, from mocking Kyla to trying to capitalize on the harassment of the airline staff. I will not be flying Southwest again unless a REAL apology is issued and this one retracted.
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